Intimacy Directors and Coordinators Podcast

Hidden Transformation in Becoming an IP

• IDC • Season 1 • Episode 6

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🎙️ Podcast Show Notes Introduction

What if the biggest thing standing between you and becoming a more effective intimacy professional is not another certification, protocol, or tool, but your own personal growth? In this episode, Marie Percy and Claire Warden tackle one of the most important and least discussed aspects of intimacy work: the internal work required to do this role ethically and effectively. From managing your own reactions and assumptions to understanding your relationship with power, validation, and control, this conversation explores why self awareness is not a bonus skill for intimacy professionals. It is a professional responsibility. Whether you are brand new to the field or years into your career, this episode offers a powerful invitation to examine how your inner world impacts every room you enter.

👂 What to Listen For

  • Why personal growth and self awareness are essential professional skills for intimacy coordinators and directors 
  • How your emotional state, body language, and energy influence the people around you, even when you say nothing 
  • The difference between sharing power and trying to control a room through fear, judgment, or assumptions 
  • Claire and Marie’s unforgettable cookie oven metaphor for identifying what belongs to you and what belongs to others 
  • How ego, validation seeking, and the desire to be the hero can quietly interfere with your ability to serve collaborators 

🔗 Important Links

SPEAKER_01

Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Intimacy Directors and Coordinators Podcast, where intimacy professionals come to keep their finger on the pulse of the entertainment industry. My name is Marie Percy. I'm one of your co-hosts today, and I'm joined by the fabulous Claire Warden.

SPEAKER_00

Hello. Oh, my fingers are itching to get on that pulse. Hi, it's nice to see you, Marie. I'm excited to chat more with you.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I have really enjoyed putting these podcast together episodes together with you and our other team members because it's just giving us the opportunity to like dig deeper into things that we're observing happening in our community and in the entertainment industry at large. And I feel like this is one of those topics today that we as an intimacy professional community should spend some time talking about and reflecting about for ourselves personally. Yeah, this is a very point the finger at you episode, not a point the finger at other people's episode.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I appreciate the fact that because we have so many of these big, deep philosophical conversations about like topics like this. And I I'm really glad that we actually get to share that with other people because we come up with like big realizations and like, oh, this is really important for the work. And now we actually get to be able to share it with everybody out there as well.

SPEAKER_01

Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I'm gonna dive right in here to our topic for today. And I'm gonna preface this by saying that I think on the surface, this might seem a little simple. It might seem like something that you're like, oh yeah, I know that, I get that, I've done that. But this is also a topic that is so it's layers of the onion, right? Like you, you, you hear it, it's simple, you think you get it, and then you discover further down the line that there are deeper layers of knowing and understanding on this topic. So I think this topic is very relevant to people who are just starting out, but also relevant to people who have been doing this work for a very long time. And so here it is. Here's what we want to talk about today. Being an intimacy professional requires personal growth and personal transformation. There is internal work, inner work, that is a prerequisite to doing this job well. It is not optional, unfortunately. It is, it is part, it is part of the process. It's part of what you need to do to do this job well. And the beautiful thing about it is that when you do the difficult internal work so that you can do the job well, the end result of that is often we see folks reclaiming more of their personal power. And so today we're gonna talk about like what that internal work is, why it's so important, and how that relates to power in our industry. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_01

It's a lot.

SPEAKER_00

It's a big one. And I I think it's it's spoken about a lot, not just in the intimacy profession, but this idea of self-knowledge and and personal growth and transformation. But I think it's I think with the work that we do, we really need to get kind of right in the nitty-gritty of it and and the the hard truth of the requirements that it actually has to the level that we need to go in order to really serve our our role in a responsible and ethical way.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, absolutely. And it's it's it's an opportunity, right? Like it is, it is, you know, I was actually talking to someone who was onboarding for our certification program recently, and she was saying, like, oh yeah, I know this is an area that I need to work on, but it's also like one of the beautiful things about doing this work is that uh becoming an intimacy coordinator requires me to know myself better and better myself, and that there's like a really nice symbiotic relationship there that like the more you're able to know yourself and help yourself, the more you're able to serve your collaborators.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And I think that word opportunity, you know, that's that's an important one. It is an opportunity, doesn't necessarily mean it's easy work, but like that opportunity to gain that intense self-knowledge, that understanding. And that I often talk about it in terms of like metabolizing our personal knowledge, personal narratives, rather, our assumptions, the the things that we've brought along with us. And and if they're not serving us or we want to develop them, for me, it feels like kind of metabolizing that through our psyche and our system. And it's a call to a like a deeper level of self-awareness, mindfulness, and integrity. And and that, yes, there's a lot of the, oh yeah, I know I need to do that. And you're like, yeah, uh, let's go. And and I will say, to get to get really direct with us, get right in there. I know because I've seen it now over these years that I've been doing this work and training people. Unless you are willing to do that work first, then you are not gonna end up being an optimal IC. One that actually, as you said, Marie, serves and supports the production, the people, and actually furthers this work in a greater level that we're doing, this kind of transformation of the industry that we're undertaking. So I think because what is so important to remember about our work is that the instrument through which we're delivering our work is ourselves, our body, right? And and no matter how much technique or craft or choreography experience or or understanding of film terms and camera lenses or or sight lines you have, everything gets delivered through you. And so you have this unavoidable effect on what you're being in the room. And I know that sometimes just an IP's body in the space changes the space, sometimes for good, and sometimes not for not in a helpful way.

SPEAKER_01

Yes.

SPEAKER_00

I also really believe that alongside with, you know, whatever our personal understanding, transformation management is, I truly believe you can't work optimally or serve the movement or the work if you are coming from a fear-based place or an assumption that people are intending to do harm. Now, absolutely understand. At the beginning, that was prevalent, right? Whether intentionally or through lack of understanding or knowledge, yes, people were causing harm, and we came in to try to stop that. And I'm not naive because I'm out in the industry every day. I'm not naive to think that there isn't still education to bring and shh cultures to shift, and people's practice and understanding of their craft in relation to consent-based workspace needs to adjust. So we must always be aware in presence of the situation. But and before I do my little butt, and I have to acknowledge that I think a lot of what's maybe underneath a fear-braced or a suspicious approach is the intention of good, like to protect, to stop harm, right, to to make it better.

SPEAKER_01

Yes.

SPEAKER_00

However, the that fear, that suspicion sometimes ends up manifesting itself, and I've seen this in intimacy professionals, manifesting itself in a bid to control everyone or control the situation. And it's that kind of idea that, well, I'm a good person, so if I take the power then from the bad people, I will then use it in a good way, and everyone will be okay. And in the world that we live in right now, especially here in America, right, it's very easy to look at power being wielded by people that are not doing it in a humane, ethical, responsible way, and say, take it away from them, give it to someone who will do better. I think when we're looking at advocacy though, the real nuance is that what we're trying to do here in this massive seismic shift of the industry, it's not about taking power from the bad and giving it to the good. It's about redistributing the power. So it's moving from that kind of power over structure, even if it's a good person, even if it's an ID or an IC, that moving from that power over structure to the power with structure. And of course, most people in productions or in sets don't really know a lot about that or how to do that. Often the ID is the or the IC is the person that has some education in that. But it requires that actually we enter a space with with more courage, more kind of deep and nuanced advocacy education, more critical analysis skills, and more really deeply honest self-knowledgement and self-management abilities in order to create that shared responsibility, that collaboration in how we do things and as a practice, like as a way of being in the world. And I don't think people realize this about intimacy work until they try to do it, or maybe they are training with people that don't include it in their training or their approach. But it's vital, it's vital to your work, to your reputation, to the movement, to the industry, to your karma points, I think, is also right, is is is actually be braver and rather than try to control. Try to control or or just ignore your stuff that comes up or think, well, I'm a good person because I'm doing this work, therefore I don't need to manage myself. Do the harder work and it'll pay enormous dividends in the end.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Okay. I want to pick out a couple different things you said there because there was a lot of really great golden nuggets in that. Um, and I just want to like highlight a couple of things you said that that really stood out for me.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

One was this idea that just an intimacy director or an intimacy coordinator's body in the space changes the space. So how you are showing up physically and energetically and emotionally is impacting the room around you. And your presence alone is going to allow you, is a powerful tool, which can allow you to shift what is happening in the space. If you are aware enough of it and have your finger on the dials, your own internal dials, your physical dials, your energetic dials, right? Like if I am in the room and I am noticing, like, oh, things are getting tense, I can start to feel the tension in my body. And then I am able to manage myself and say, like, ooh, I'm feeling that tension. I'm gonna access my breath, my grounding, some of my physical tools that helps me experience and be present with a heightened experience in the room, right? That that then if I'm able to dial myself down, that will then impact other people in the room and they will be able to access more grounding, right? So that's that is in a nutshell what co-regulation is and something that we constantly do and be bringing to the space. And so that's that's just one way in which this self-knowledge becomes essential to the role piece manifests, right? Like that's one concrete example. Another concrete example.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, go ahead, you want to say something else, and then I'll well, yeah, also, but just to add to that, also, if you if you are sitting in judgment, yes, or criticism, or suspicion, or fear, or if there is need for yourself to be validated and that is in your body, that you people will pick up on that. You may not say any words to it, but uh we are part of that co-regulation is that we are so sensitive as beings to each other that will sit in the space. If you if you are not if you are shut down because you haven't practiced enough the ability to be with someone, either learning how to do something or being flexible to other people's needs instead of like having an iron fist around, but this must be done because that's what it said on my sheet. No, you this that's the clothes that is only these people, then you're you're also going to affect the space and how people are receiving you.

SPEAKER_01

And so, in many ways, you can have all the protocols, you can say the right thing, you can do the right thing, you can check all the boxes and still not do the job well. Yes. Because if if you are actually imposing your subconscious desire for control or your subconscious desire for validation on the process, that is then gonna cause it's gonna cause problems, right? Because then it becomes about you. And this work is not about you, it's about the people you're serving, the people you're advocating for, the people you're supporting. And so something else that I just wanted to pull out that Claire spoke to earlier is is, and I'm gonna read just share a different way of thinking about it, but like we have to avoid black and white thinking as intimacy professionals, right? So if we come into the space and we assume that people have bad intentions or are going to cause harm, or we label other people bad, or or even have judgments about choices that actors are making, right? Like if you come in and you're like, I don't think we should ask the actor to do that because I think they might be uncomfortable, and then all of a sudden the actor is fine, but you internally have a judgment about that action, right? Like those sorts of judgments and then black and white thinking of like good, bad, I'm the hero and they're the villain. Those things also interfere with and create static around what's actually happening. Like those things are just unuseful coping mechanisms that are creating noise in our head that are designed to keep us and our egos feeling happy and safe. Like it's much easier for me, if somebody upsets me, for me to write them off as, oh, they're bad, they're causing harm, they're doing the wrong thing, versus, well, if I really sit with it and allow us all to be human and make mistakes and miscommunicate and fumble our way through things sometimes. Coming from that space of openness allows for dialogue and collaboration, versus if I have labeled you as the bad guy, that's the end of conversation. That's the end of collaboration. It's it's over at that point. There's nothing you can do.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And and and to do that, to be able to be open to it, requires extreme generosity and generosity towards people with the potential for doing something we might have to deal with or even harm, it requires courage, right? We have to be willing, to be brave, and to be generous. And part of that is having soothed our own wounds and thoughts and reactions to past a behavior of the industry or an individual in order to look at this kind of restorative justice approach as opposed to this kind of cancel culture or you know, punitive justice approach, which doesn't serve anyone moving forward.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And ultimately that's our job, right? Like our job is to facilitate the project moving forward somehow, regardless of what comes up on the project.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And the industry moving forward, knowing what has happened already, but being focused on where we want to be, it's that courageous imagination of a better way that that and if if you're not ready to do that, that's fine. Like you don't have to do that right away. But I think that is a number one step before you start doing the work. So if this is work that is of interest to you, or if this is work you're doing now, like I think it really behooves us to really think about our ability to do those things we've been discussing in order to actually fulfill our role in a in a ethical way.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. So I have a fun metaphor that I want to share with you all. And Claire and I came up with this metaphor a couple of years ago when we were like riffing on ideas for the intimacy professional accelerator program. So here's here's this metaphor, okay? I want you to imagine you're in a kitchen and there's multiple people in this kitchen and there's multiple ovens. Everybody has their own oven and everybody's baking cookies, right?

SPEAKER_00

And I love this already. Right.

SPEAKER_01

There's cookies. And you notice that there is some smoke in the air, right? And so you're the intimacy professional, you're in charge of safety, you start running around checking everybody else's oven. You're opening ovens, you're slamming them shut, you're like, excuse me, you've got the bad oven, you're burning your cookies, right? Or, oh, let me save you from your burning cookies, right? Like you're you're casting judgments and aspersions and and and you know, trying to get to the bottom of it. The question is though, have you checked your own oven? Are your cookies the ones that are burning? Right? So, so sometimes there can be anxiety, distress, I hate to use the word, but drama, you know, conflict, and it's in the air, right? And it just seems to be part of the project, or it can overwhelm individual collaborators, right? And like your job as the intimacy professional is to make sure your cookies are not the ones that are burning, right? And you need to know what's in your oven and what temperature they start burning at, and when your oven is gonna start smoking, and to manage your own oven so that you can be present with what other people might need. And you're not pointing fingers or or being overly controlling or any of that. That's my fun metaphor for this.

SPEAKER_00

I love it. Or and even to extend it even more, right? So, you know, that the ability to then go, okay, I smell the smoke, should check this out. Do I just turn my oven down or do I need to turn it all the way off before I do that? So that as I, depending on how long this is going to take to find out where the smoke is from, my cookies don't burn. Like my cookies stay where they need to stay. And then at the end of the day, I can come back and see, or they'll need another 10 minutes, or they're good, right? And then and then to just like rather be in that panic or that point of fingers, just like maybe starting with I'm seeing some smoke, folks. Yeah. Should we look at everybody want to just check their oven for a second and see where their cookies are? Like that's a and it could be that easy. And someone could be like, oh my goodness, you're right. Thank you so much, Glenn. My cookies are burning. It's all right, I'll just turn it down. Or I think then I'll take it out. And it could be, it could be like, it could be like that.

SPEAKER_01

I just need five to tend to my cookies. I'll be in the hall. Right, everybody, let's take five.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01

Uh so I wanna I wanna talk a little bit about what it is like on the other side of really having done this work and and being able to bring this to the work of an intimacy director or coordinator and kind of what what that experience is like. Because I think, A, there's always more work to be done, right? Like we all are living groups. Breathing human beings and will constantly be changing. So, this is something for every single one of us to keep our fingers on the pulse of. But also, I think there is a point at which you've done enough of this work to become effective in the room. And what I see happen in that moment is a profound shift in personal power. Because when you truly know what is yours, what is happening inside you, and you have the tools you need to manage yourself and have the emotional resilience to work through challenging situations, that's you know, it's just it's badass, right? Like that is some crazy amazing personal power. Because what you're saying is like I am grounded, nothing is gonna shake me, nothing is gonna move me. I know what is what needs to happen, I know who is responsible for what smoke that is in the air, and I am able, like some sort of martial arts master, to to uh move the energy through the space and facilitate so that we can move forward and to de-escalate. It's it's it's pretty magical, like when you see somebody who's really good at this in process. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Yeah. And it makes me think, you know, once you've kind of found that that power, that like personal power, but also stepped into managing the power in a space and taking on some of that, some of that power because with our title, Intimacy Director, Intimacy Coordinator, comes an expectation of power and facilitation and leadership. I think you also have to be really wary of the kind of the winding journey of how you use that power. And and I'll speak like personally and share, you know, some of my my journey, which was like really realizing that the ego is a slippery beast. And I've I've really had a powerful and illuminating journey of of continuing to wrestle the ego or soothe the ego in order to do the work in integris way, because it is not and it cannot be about you as the ID or the IC. In this this work just can't be a path to validation or you know recognition or notoriety, because that gets in the way of you serving the people you're working with. And I've seen that in other people, I've seen it, I've started to to clock it in myself and then realizing, oh, this this is something that we really need to dig in. Because this is a service role, and there's nothing, there isn't anything inherently wrong, but if you have motivations, or if you're clocking motivations of wanting to be seen or validated as a good person, or the right person, or the one who can save people or the industry, or the first one to do this, or the best one, or proving something to someone else about this, or the most righteous one, or the one who really knows about advocacy and education, or who's the most integrous, or you're trying to heal your own trauma through this work. This is that will interfere with what your focus should be, which is helping other people. This is not the place, as in doing the work, is not the place for any of that. There's nothing wrong with any of those motivations at all. They're all fine and good. That's part of being human. But I have realized that we need to find the validation, the recognition, the healing, the working through of those things outside of our work as an intimacy professional. So with our beloved community, with our therapists, with our self-care, with our other things that we might do for with our volunteer work for the neighborhood, you know, with our discussion book that group that we've we've formed. I remember like, and I will share this, no names, no in identifying information, but just last week I was talking with a producer of a major TV show who had gone through a number of ICs as and had a number of ICs that have worked and not brought them back or had to fire them or not want to work with them again, and who who said, you know, some of the ICs were very self-important. And I was like, oh, like that hit hard because that's and I don't I don't believe any of those ICs were trying to do something, but I think what happens is that the motivations or the needs that we have can interfere with our work if we're not really managing where we get them met. And so I just say, and because I've I've that and actually once once you do manage to get through that, it's actually uh it's a much easier and nicer place to be.

SPEAKER_01

You're not giving your power away to these other external things of validation or or needing to be right or righteous or saving people. Those are all stories that we're telling about ourselves and about the work that are outside of our control. And so it's going to create a more roller coaster type experience for you.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Because you're trying to get something and maybe you get it, and maybe you don't. And whether or not you get that, and whether or not you get another job with that person are all going to be like this complicated soup of experience. Yeah. And all of that is taking away from your own personal power and your ability to stay grounded and be the most invisible but also most helpful person on the project. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And and and once you kind of can can manage those and remove those motivations from your work, then how the day goes does not make or ruin your life. Like you can have a really tough day on set and just be like, oof, well, that one was a doozy. Whoa, that was a hard day. Not as successful as I'd like. Okay, what planning do I need to do next time? Great, got it. Let's move on. So I I just I think I just offer to everybody like really, it's a really important and I think fascinating if if if maybe slightly exposing of exercise to really examine your motivations, what's drawing you to this work and what you hope to get out of it. And you know, wrestle that beast that is your ego in every moment. And it might be it might be that it's fine to be in front because it is hurt or wounded and it needs attention and it needs healing, and that's okay. And do that, like find that out so that you can attend, you can heal, you can metabolize, you can soothe, you can move on, or manage, and then be more free to actually do the work of this service role in an effective and ethical way.

SPEAKER_01

Boom. There it is.

SPEAKER_00

Boom.

SPEAKER_01

I think we have to wrap this up because we've been going for quite a while here, and this is this is a lot to to think about and chew on. So, as you all are listening to this, we always like to hear back from you. If there's anything that resonated with you or questions you have or things you're thinking about, you can DM us at IDC Professionals on Instagram, or you can also email us at info at idcprofessionals.com so that we know, you know, what's on your mind, what's on your heart, and your process, and so we can continue to speak to that as we're recording more of these fun little podcast episodes.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, please. We'd love to hear your thoughts, your reactions, and like what the conversations you are having or wanting to have about this work so that we can we can continue to have them with you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you so much for listening, y'all. As always, make sure you subscribe, share, save, all that good stuff. And we will see you next time on the IBC Podcast.